Cheat Engine

[predprey]

[STN]

Meh, they are deluded as always.

You have an interesting point h3x1c but you're forgetting its CH we're talking about lol.

CH's biggest enemy is CH itself. All this interest you see in cosmos right now is because it's a shiny new thing, pretty soon it will fade away and nobody is going to use it anymore. I mean can you imagine using a tool made by CH and ever asking for support or help, Chris will rip you a new asshole if you do that like he does on daily basis of his loyal customers.

[predprey]

my marketing perspective is that CH probably got their target base for Cosmos wrong, or this is just a move to test waters. not much cost, if it succeeds, good, if not, no harm done. if it succeeds they could also have their own community that posts quality tables and since its made with Cosmos they could use the cheats in their own trainers, improving their quality and rep to attract more customers, forming a virtuous cycle or multiplier effect. but the ones who posts tables are probably the ones who prefer something lightweight and fast than modern ui. sorta like the hackers/geeks who prefer linux to windows, the android to apple. i can't understand them promoting it as a tool for newbies since by the time the newbies learn how to use Cosmos, they are no longer newbies and would also prefer something lightweight and fast. three years ago i bought their lifetime member because there wasnt a working table for the newest version of witcher 1, i was still a noob then. but today i think the tables here are not lacking and some even have features you cannot find in trainers anywhere unless their developers take the effort to implement an additional editor. my best guess is CH wants a similar community there, maybe a few CE cheatmakers to migrate to a modern flashier ui, but misaligned what cheatmakers value most. so until they can improve on the speed and apparent stability(how it feels) of Cosmos the uptake of Cosmos would probably be slow and without an existing community to guide them along the newbies would be stuck at searching for static values then posting tables of static addresses.

[atom0s]

[++METHOS]

As already mentioned, CE is more than just a software...it's a community. Everything here is free and people are helpful at all levels. CE is always being improved on and anything that is lacking can be requested to be implemented, which happens regularly.

There is no question where my loyalty lies. Most of my learning that wasn't by way of self-discovery came from CEF members.

I think it's important to note that the member dynamic is different. CE is for learners and CH is for leechers. Granted, we have both, but when the leechers eventually want to be learners, I don't expect the money-seekers to give out anything of real value as that would challenge their business model. CH is good about capturing newbies that don't know any better. When they smarten up and realize that other options are available, many of them may leave, especially if they want to learn something.

[Caliber]

h3x1c
"That's great and all, but they're clearly using CE source for core functionality of the program"

No.. CH is not using CheatEngine source code.. at all.. please have proof of statements like this before you embarass yourself and start these flame wars all over again. We have no beef with Darkbyte, nor are we stealing from him. I have personally PM him over the years many times and asked for specific help with using Cheatengine and even some questions on other topics, but to claim we ripped his source code and then providing zero proof of it, and now look at all the crap you just started... over here at Cheatengine forums..again.... when it's been nice a peaceful for a long time.. Notice that Darkbyte isn't making these accusations or causing a fuss over this, it's anti-CH folks coming out from under the floorboards like roaches doing all this...


++METHOS
"but they'll never be as good as CE...only copycats, in my opinion"

We aren't trying to remake CE. Maybe you should read up what our product is for and how it is doing some things differently. It's free, as well, so nobody is forced to buy it. Cheatengine isn't and wasn't the only memory editor ever created. In fact, I am not sure if it was the first. We all use it, so this isn't about us trying to re-invent the wheel, either.. I actually use some tools I created myself that I probably will never release that I use more than Cheatengine in terms of the specific use.. But the point is that this isn't about trying to replace Cheatengine.


h3x1c
"Indeed. And I realize that, but it's a testament to their character (or lack thereof, specifically) there and I want to put them on full-blast for it. "

Actually you just made yourself look like an idiot.. for defaming another site without proof of your statements... that isn't in very good character.. but it IS pretty much what you do on a regular basis.



mgr.inz.Player
"Tried it:
- while using "Viewer" ScrollBar - crash.
- "find AOB" also crashed few times. "

Thanks for the feedback. Cheatengine never had any problems during development at all.. ask Darkbyte.. everything worked peachy without user feedback or bugs.. right from the start, the last 7 years..


STN
"They haven't ripped CE's source code, it is based on other open source engines. Well, they obviously have ripped parts from CE such as speedhack. "

Are you sure 0x90 ripped the code for speedhack? It's based on the kernal timer which is a windows api .dll call... the IDEA isn't new, admittedly.. It might be possible that 0x90 used some math calculation for the speedhack value from Darkbyte, and if so then he will put that in the documentation.

"I like how nonchalant Dark byte is about all of this."

This is because Darkbyte isn't a douche like many people are. He is busy working on his products and code, and supporting folks who use his product, like folks over at CH are, and leaving people alone, while others stir crap like this up constantly.. We've already reached out to him to make sure he understands the purpose of our tool and that we don't want any sort of conflict with him or cheatengine...

"CH sucks at making things for public"

We have more free trainers and our site has more trainer related and game cheating related postings than almost any other site. Now, we don't have more SCRIPTS than Cheatengine, but to claim we don't have 'free stuff' is just not true. However, it's hard to stay open if we aren't charging subscriptions, and we've never pretended to NOT be a subscription site. Nothing is free. Someone pays for everything, eventually. What exactly have we put out that is free that 'sucks'...

"If anyone can't figure out how to use CE, i think they have something fundamentally wrong in them that fancy graphics of cosmos will not solve. "
"even a retard can use CE"

Well we disagree. Not everyone thinks cheatengine is 'newb friendly', which is the whole purpose of us providing something for our members to help them with certain games or to do things THEY want to do with games by themselves in certain situations, or while they wait for us to update some unpopular title. Some people will use Cosmos because of the simplicity for simple things like giving money in games that we probably won't train or are totally script games with no descriptors in the chain, which making a normal trainer is stupid. The user can just give themselves money in seconds or find their health and freeze it, etc. I guess time will tell. Having a simpler alternative or something 'different' or a unique choice isn't uncommon. For instance, it seems a group of people created TRAINERS that run differently from what other trainers have historically worked because they think users are too dumb to do certain things (like run the trainer and see if it works and then go download the newer trainer if it needs update), so it does it for them as well (if it works correctly, or if the updated trainer is actually created). Or they are trying to compete with other trainer sites by trying to make their trainers do things for the users that trainers haven't done in the past.. stupid crap, like activating options on your trainer with an IPAD when the keyboard is right in front of you... stuff like that. See how things improve or change over time, or provide a solution to make things simpler? Or just have features that sound cool but actually are stupid and provide no real benefit.. so that people might try them out..


h3x1c
"They're motivated by the prospect of money"

And I guess none of the people here are..

I can document more than one person on this thread who contacted Cheathappens looking for work...

I can also document that some people's 'sites' are about to go 'paid' that are free right now... or other people who make programs that work on MP cheat sites and ARE DEFINITELY PAID..

I leave it up to these nebulous folks to come clean.. or not. I'll probably have all 30,000 of Hillary Clinton's deleted e-mails before that happens..

"I fully expect them at some point to start running ads and video promos directly calling out CE and pointing out its "flaws" as compared to their...well, whatever they have at the time: noob-friendliness, GUI, filtering options, etc. "

Well you guessed wrong. We have no interest in going to war with Darkbyte and Cheatengine. It's stupid. In fact our scripts work on Cheatengine and vice versa..



ulysse3131
"Btw they also import CE tables. "

Yes, and cheatengine can import the tables we make over at cheathappens. It's like word processor programs, that can export and import files to work across different applications that do similar things. Since our scripts and the program Cosmos are both FREE, just like Cheatengine, it's only going to help both sites that we can share and use each other's scripts. If a user at cheathappens posts a script for a game with no trainers, feel free to take it and post it at cheatengine.. we don't care. It's all FREE CONTENT that STN says we suck at providing..


atom0s
"It's CH, they are known for copying things from others. Wouldn't be the first time. Won't be their last. "

And atom0s is known for reaming donkeys in the bum, sometimes he reams a whole family of donkeys in the bum at a time. I mean if you can just say defamatory things as if it's the truth, then so can I.


_Veggy
"Amen to that atom0s "

Ditto, donkey reamer..

Actually it's documented that WE get ripped, right here on cheatengine forums..

http://forum.cheatengine.org/viewtopic.php?p=5589472&sid=bf1e385be9294e5aae1c8f57c5488e00

http://forum.cheatengine.org/viewtopic.php?t=571528&sid=cc3f136f5c61786802aa04a4c4c6fd5f

http://forum.cheatengine.org/viewtopic.php?p=5552468&sid=094a86b92e518b8aded6a38b8ae33b60

I could go on, but that donkey bum probably is more appealing to you..


h3x1c
"Here's a CH moment of zen: "

That is a completely factual statement at that link.. go look at Sethoiz and MrantiFock and how they added things, step by step, same options in the same order, just after we (and also cheatengine free table, apparently) added things.. But HERE is an actual moment of zen..

http://www.cheathappens.com/show_board2.asp?headID=130480&titleID=22269&onPage=1

More Zen

http://www.cheathappens.com/show_board2.asp?headID=130542&titleID=22269&onPage=1

That user Cooperb has since apologized by PM... he was having a 'bad day'...

Back to the subject, I didn't take the time to document when STN added options (or anyone else in here who created trainers for NMS), and what he added.. maybe you can do that for us.. it IS interesting to see certain IP numbers pop up on our logs on the site.. folks might want to VPN sometimes.. to make it interesting..



STN
"Meh, they are deluded as always. "

Speaking of shiny new things that fade away....over and over..

"Chris will rip you a new asshole if you do that like he does on daily basis of his loyal customers."

Yes, all we do is rip assholes over at CH.. and then continue to increase subscriptions and provide improved trainers and tools for our members.. now I am having to come here and rip assholes over here... in a situation where, literally, we aren't even causing any problems for Darkbyte nor Cheatengine at all..

It's really a shame people don't have all the information about our PM conversations with STN over the years.. it would probably be enlightening.. but we aren't really interested in doing that, at least at this point. And to think I defended you in the past..

http://forum.cheatengine.org/viewtopic.php?p=5611863#5611863

++METHOS
"CE is for learners and CH is for leechers"

This is probably the most laughable post on here. YOU WONT FIND A BIGGER BUNCH OF LEECHERS THAN FOLKS WHO COME HERE BEGGINING FOR SCRIPTS FOR THE NEXT BIG GAME. I don't blame them or even flame them. It's just that the scripts are FREE, so they don't want to pay for them. What you call 'leechers' is people who are actually PAYING FOR the product.. I call people who beg and request ad-infinatum for FREE SCRIPTS the real leeches. For those of you who slave hours and hours for these folks and provide these scripts for free, then more power to you. For those who come here for the free scripts, more power to you as well. Not everyone can code. Not everyone will code for free, either. I mean, under this logic the people who buy groceries from the supermarket are LEECHES, since they don't grow the wheat themselves, but pay for it. And the beggar on the side of the road where the wheat is grown who gets a handout from the farmer are 'learners'.. So what is your opinion of FLING or STN or other people who make actual trainers for 'free' (well, free for now).. are the people who use them leechers or learners?




The simple fact of the matter is that we HAVE NO INTEREST IN A WAR with CHEATENGINE. I respect and enthusiastically support and encourage people to support Darkbyte and cheatengine. DARKBYTE is the only person whom we care about his opinion in this endeavor, and so far he has said nothing about Cosmos. Probably because our product is Pepsi and his product is Coke. They are similar but have different user in mind, and different user interface. We don't want to replace Cheatengine and have no interest in 'destroying cheatengine'. We made our tool import and export the same scripts so that both tools Cosmos and Cheatengine can share scripts. Most of the butthurt comments are people here who are literally UNAFFECTED by our tool and are just posting here to display their jealousy or whatever other unrelated motivation for thier anti-CH remarks. And, I honestly don't have any interest in going back and forth with the 5-6 or so of you here that repeatably take every opportunity to flame CH whenever possible, while we continue to flourish.

I encourage people who are open minded to test out the product and see what it actually does and what is does differently, and maybe more streamlined or simpler. We won't call you a retard because you had trouble with cheatengine concepts and want to see if there is a simpler alternative to what you do. We have a ton of videos and etc. to help people get used to using it. If you have 10 years of history with Cheatengine, then likely you are comfortable with it and don't need another alternative. If you like Cheatengine, then GREAT. So do a lot of US. Some people can't even code hardly AT ALL and use cheatengine from start to finish to make ALL THEIR TRAINERS.. fine and dandy..

In the end, both are free, and we have no interest in becoming a problem for Cheatengine and it's users. Darkbyte is one of the few people over the years who has literally remained an impartial and friendly relationship over the years, in the little bit that we have had to interact. He doesn't start from a position of confrontation and is a welcoming developer. I have nothing but respect and appreciation for him and cheatengine.

It would be nice if people would actually appreciate the effort by 0x90 and since he has no plans to make the product COST ANYTHING and is doing this FOR FREE and FOR ANYONE WHO WANTS TO USE IT, as well as the SCRIPTS BEING FREE.. it would be nice to have some positive statements from people for once. 0x90 hasn't done anything to any of you, and has put a lot of effort into this. If you don't care for it, then just continue using cheatengine and, at the very least, quit posting information that is blatantly wrong or defamatory.


Again, here:


http://www.cheathappens.com/show_board2.asp?headID=130480&titleID=22269&onPage=1



Darkbyte if you are reading, if you have any issues with ANYTHING, please let us know. We have no intention of trying to cause cheatengine any harm. I think you can appreciate the different approach of Cosmos in the way memory is searched and filtered. As always, thanks for your wonderful FREE tool Cheatengine and your support over the years.

[h3x1c]

Okay, okay. There's clearly a lot of history here I've tapped into that's beyond the scope of my time spent here. Cal, I provided anecdotal evidence as to reasons why I thought CoSMOS was at the very least taking heavy doses of inspiration from CE. The burden of the proof of my claim ultimately rests on my shoulders, and I don't have that, so in taking your word at face value, I'll apologize for being incorrect in my assumption.

You took my comment about making money out of context. Objectively, there's nothing wrong with that; it was simply setting up motive for what I said directly afterward. But you've addressed that point, so I'll take you at your word for that as well.

I agree in regards to Sethioz and MrAntiFun -- specifically Sethioz right now; that guy couldn't be ripping off everyone any harder if he tried with NMS, lol. Very disappointed in him for going that route so blatantly, but it is what it is.

I'll leave your personal attacks against me at the door. I would just delete this thread as I don't even want it to stick around for things to heat up, but I can't, so maybe DB or another admin can just proceed with that. This doesn't need to be something it shouldn't all due to what appears to be a misconception on my behalf.

[Zanzer]

What, are you saying Caliber didn't take "inspiration" from my No Man's Sky table too?!

[h3x1c]

My name's Paul, and this is between y'all, lol. It's clear where my loyalties lie and me saying anything else at this point is merely going to fan the flames of a fire I didn't build (speaking about a past I'm only just now being acutely clued in on). Cal already resorted to personal attacks, so it's clear there's nothing constructive to happen here where he's concerned in relation to any gripes or personal observations, so...

[++METHOS]

Caliber would have been better off not posting.

[atom0s]

Don't worry about what Caliber says h3x1c, no one on this forum has respect for him pretty much. Just ignore him. He'll spew a bunch of non-sense anytime people bring up his crappy site on here.

[ulysse31]

[PinPoint]

[predprey]

tbf CH really caters to the inexperienced in both UI and UX, even their editors have a neat layout compared to tables with lots of manual edit pointers. Cosmos does bring a few new features that caters to the newbies and also UX improvements, but as i said, targetting such a tool at newbies seems contradictory even if it is made newb-friendly. time will tell i guess, maybe i will post one script there just to give it a little boost. so on that respect CH is more retard proof than CE, i do have pple telling me they do not know what is attach process and how to do it. i still use CH occasionally when im too lazy to code and tables are not out yet, they are fast with basic trainer options. also use their editors sometimes. so CH does complement my experience with CE, along with FLING.

[mgr.inz.Player]